22 replies to this topic

[Kaleidoscope]

Interesting article for your consideration and debate:





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For a white man's execution, where are black protesters?
Outcry on behalf of Tookie might be viewed as race-based
Jasmyne A. Cannick

Sunday, January 8, 2006


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Los Angeles -- In the wee hours of the morning of Jan. 17, another man will be put to death by lethal injection in the state of California. This comes exactly 36 days after the execution of Stanley Tookie Williams. But where are the protesters?

With just a few days to go before the scheduled execution of a 76-year-old blind and deaf man who uses a wheelchair, there has been no public outcry of support for clemency for Clarence Ray Allen, who is white. There have been no planned protests and celebrity read-ins in support of saving an old man's life. Community activists and civil rights leaders aren't organizing statewide tours to bring attention to Allen's execution. There hasn't even been one "Kill Clarence Ray Allen Hour" from KFI-AM's "John and Ken Show."

Which raises the question: Was the community cry for clemency for Williams because he was a black man, or was it because the death penalty is immoral, inhumane and cruel?

Granted, Allen hasn't written any children's books, been nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize, or had a Hollywood actor play him in a film, but that doesn't mean his life isn't worth saving.

The fight for clemency should not have died with Williams. With two more executions scheduled in California, including that of Michael Morales, who was convicted at the age of 21 for the rape and murder of a 17-year-old female, now is not the time for all of Williams' supporters to retreat to their separate corners of the world. In fact, it's time for the opposite. We need to get back into action and show the world that the fight for clemency for Williams was not solely based on the fact that he was a black man but rather that he was a man who did not deserve to have his life prematurely taken from him, no matter how heinous the crimes he was convicted of committing.

The state Legislature is considering a moratorium on the death penalty. Although a decision didn't come soon enough to save Williams' life, our work could aid in saving the lives of many other condemned prisoners.

Black Californians who supported clemency for Williams need to re-examine their reasons for wanting Williams to live. Was it because he was a black man? Was it because he co-founded the Crips? Was it because of his anti-gang and anti-drug work? Or was it because we abhor the death penalty?

Allen poses no significant risk. Blind and deaf, it's very unlikely that he will be ordering the killing of anyone if left to live his remaining days on Death Row.

Many of the black leaders who supported clemency for Williams vehemently denied they were racists when challenged by a pair of conservative radio DJs in Los Angeles who sponsored the repulsive "Kill Tookie Hour." Accusing the black leadership of getting involved in the fight to save Williams only because he was black, the shock jocks noted that these same activists were going to be nowhere to be found when the next execution of a nonblack person came up.

If all of the protests around clemency for Williams were not just for show, it should be no problem for the black community to reassemble for the fight to save Clarence Ray Allen. He may not have been our homeboy from back in the day, or demonstrated to the world that he is a redeemed man. He may not even be likable, but his life is worth trying to save. What kind of message does it send if we sit back and do nothing while another person is systematically put to death on our watch?

Jasmyne A. Cannick is a Los Angeles-based writer and a member of the National Association of Black Journalists. She wrote this commentary for Pacific News Service.

[Euler's Ghost]

What does race even have to do with anything here?  The author of this artice hasn't made any arguments for why we might suspect race was an issue for any of the protesters.  So why should we suspect that it was?  It's like saying, "If Tookie's name hadn't started with the letter T, would anyone be trying to save him?"

[pebbles]

If anything, the arguments that Clarence Allen's life is just as much worth saving - make a case against the death penalty in general.

I think the whole "gang boy changes and becomes good person" was a ray of hope for a lot of people, and they latched onto the case of Tookie because it hit close to home.  If it was about race, there would be a disparity between the protests against applying the death penalty of all white prisoners vs all black prisoners. This article doesn't make that claim at all.

[BlueCordFFA]

Euler said:

What does race even have to do with anything here?  The author of this artice hasn't made any arguments for why we might suspect race was an issue for any of the protesters.  So why should we suspect that it was?  It's like saying, "If Tookie's name hadn't started with the letter T, would anyone be trying to save him?"

Have you actually read the article?

[pebbles]

BlueCordFFA said:

Have you actually read the article?

I had the same reaction as Euler's Ghost. The writer makes no case for saying that race was a factor other than one prisoner was white and the other black.  He makes no attempt to control for, or otherwise explain the many other factors that might affect why one person recieved a mass of support and the other didn't.  Just because one guy is black and the other isn't, doesn't mean race has to be the 'big' factor in why people give support.

Saying race is a big factor without providing supportive evidence is counter-productive, imo. If it IS a factor, the writer should be able to provide evidence for it.

[mrdavesanchez]

I think this letter should have been written specifically to Jesse Jackson because that is truly who I think this issue addresses.

[Kelly A]

pebbles said:

The writer makes no case for saying that race was a factor other than one prisoner was white and the other black.

I have to agree. While the author brings up an interesting concept, she fails to follow through.  I would like to see a sample size of greater than two for these statistics.

It may just be a matter of timing. Personally, I'm more outraged at this one than the other since (as the author pointed out) he doesn't seem to pose any threat whatsoever . However, I'm sick and fucking tired of hearing the "you must be for murder if you're against killing" argument at the moment. It's futile to argue against absurdity.

[Sweden]

Gotta love people who still desperately try to pin race labels on people... In the 21st century! Amazing.

What on earth does "race" (whatever the hell that concept is supposed to mean) have to do with anything.? One would have hoped that the racial concept died with Hitler.

Well, then again, why not just blames those damn blacks...it's worked before...

/D

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

[Kelly A]

Sweden said:

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

I think that's out of line. Not like it's a secret. Do you get offended when Donna agrees with my point of view?

[Nelson Plywood]

Sweden said:

Gotta love people who still desperately try to pin race labels on people... In the 21st century! Amazing.

What on earth does "race" (whatever the hell that concept is supposed to mean) have to do with anything.? One would have hoped that the racial concept died with Hitler.

Well, then again, why not just blames those damn blacks...it's worked before...

/D

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

What the fuck are you talking about?

[Euler's Ghost]

BlueCordFFA said:

Have you actually read the article?

I did read it, yeah.  Maybe I need it explained to me?

[DericksHam]

heheh. i guess it happens everywhere. the race that makes up most of the population is always suspected of being racist, while hardly anyone dare to accuse members of a minority grp of being racist.

they might look like hypocrites, but it's not unusual for protest groups to support a notable/infamous/noticeable person , rather than any olde bugger nobody cares about. protest grps aren't social workers. imo, most of em just rant  alot for a while, lose steam, and just don't bother. i wonder if they really think of doing it for 'the people', or is it just in vain. a little outlet for the self-righteous. they're good for raising awareness, and usually, that is all.

[BlueCordFFA]

Sweden said:

Gotta love people who still desperately try to pin race labels on people... In the 21st century! Amazing.

What on earth does "race" (whatever the hell that concept is supposed to mean) have to do with anything.? One would have hoped that the racial concept died with Hitler.

Well, then again, why not just blames those damn blacks...it's worked before...

/D

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

The fact that I posted does not mean that I was defending or even agreeing with Christie (my wife); she simply posted an article for debate.  Agree with it or disagree but why do you feel the need to have a personal dig?

[BlueCordFFA]

Euler said:

I did read it, yeah.  Maybe I need it explained to me?

I'm sure you don't.

[DrinkTheElixir]

Sweden said:

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

Hardly a secret.  David is married to Christie and used to have the user name Pylon - what exactly is your point?  It is starting to look like a personal vendetta.   Get over it.

[Sweet Fanny Addams]

It is amazing how people who like to get on high horses and act morally superior still   somehow find it acceptable to make personal attacks on other members. Can you say "hypocrite"? :rolleyes:

[Kaleidoscope]

Sweden said:

(It's still funny when people totally undercover defend the postings of their secret significant others. :cool: )

I am very confused about your comment here. Firstly, since I merely posted an article for debate and did not express an opinion, how could my husband be defending me? Please explain.

Also, what is it that you mean by "secret significant others"?  Our marriage was announced publicly on the boards some time ago in the "Fix up Feaks" thread in Love & Life, which was a quite popular thread by the way. Maybe you should visit other parts of the boards to get a bigger picture of life here on murmurs and it's members. A well rounded person is a happy person :)


Back on topic, I think the disparity of popular protest at one planned execution over another is maybe more to do with glamour than race, although the race part feeds into that. It's a more interesting story to the mainstream media in America to portray blacks up for execution as part of a concerted effort by the judicial system to discrimate against minorities, which may or may not be true, I don't know.

To me, it's more about media and hype rather than the merits of individual cases, but there is definitely a disparity in the protestations of those against the death penalty in general.

That's my opinion, and I'd love to engage in an intelligent conversation on the topic with anyone who is interested.

[Sweden]

I apologize for derailing the thread.

[DrinkTheElixir]

That is good of you to say Sweden - you know, we get it that you have a particular dislike for David and Christie, because you have made digs before.  It just gets old, you know?   I just didn't understand what you were trying to do - it looked like goading.  Anyway, I am sure that your apology will be well received.

Happy New Year to you :)

[Kelly A]

I guess for me, this case just shows that the death penalty is more about revenge than anything else.