72 replies to this topic

[REMCHICAGOBOY]

I just realized yesterday, while reading some of the reviews from fans about Collapse into Now on Amazon that Michael is waving "goodbye" on the cover. I was looking at the cover while reading some of the reviews, and it struck me, "Oh my God, that is Michael waving "goodbye"..."

It's so obvious now.

That's all.

"All The Best". (loooove that song!)  

[stipeeyes]

The same could be said for Around the Sun(my least favorite album cover).  The way the three of their images are blurred out. As if they are fading away.  When I look at the Collapse cover I see Michael with his hand up.  Who knows maybe he's waving goodbye.  I'd like him to be the one to say it though.

Since 2001 when I joined here. Since Reveal someone has said on here, it's their last album.  Same thing for ATS, Accelerate and Collapse.  Of course Collapse is now the last one.  Or I would read they should break up, they need to break up.  Why wish for that?  There are certain people who cannot stand that something or someone can make another person happy.  It's like people have been jealous of R.E.M. since the beginning.  They must have been asked by journalists a thousands times  "When are you going to break up?   That's why Bill said yeah we'll break up in 1999 on New Years Eve.  So when that year came.  Certain journalists remembered and kept asking them in 1998 if it was true.  They were like it was a joke.  People have always taken R.E.M. too seriously.

[Mottje t.H.]

The whole album is a "good bye"-album :-(
I only noticed after Eddie Vedder's text-changings in IHT, listened to the whole album again and was a quite shocked:
How could I have overheard all those hints???!!! I mean it's beginning with "Discoverer"!!! I must have had a lack of "finesse" ;-) :-(
But only after their disbanding the songs on CIN have made sense for me!  :-( :-( :-(

[robertandrews]

Collapse Into Now is the main reason I wasn't surprised about their announcement.

[Sweet Fanny Addams]

robertandrews, on 10 October 2011 - 09:27 AM, said:

Collapse Into Now is the main reason I wasn't surprised about their announcement.

Please expand on that, I'm intrigued.

[OatiosSpellCheck]

Sweet Fanny Addams, on 10 October 2011 - 10:01 AM, said:

Please expand on that, I'm intrigued.

How about the complete lack of promotion, besides a few individual magazine interviews. Mills saying on several occasions that he wasn't sure there was a future for the band...

I mean they didn't even play on Letterman, which they almost do.

If anyone was surprised by the announcement, you weren't paying attention. Forget cryptic lyrics or cover art - a band doesn't pour their heart and soul into an album and NOT promote it unless they've reached a full stop.

The only thing surprising is that they made a formal announcement. I think most of expected them to just fade away...

[REMCHICAGOBOY]

Mottje t.H., on 10 October 2011 - 08:57 AM, said:

The whole album is a "good bye"-album :-(
I only noticed after Eddie Vedder's text-changings in IHT, listened to the whole album again and was a quite shocked:
How could I have overheard all those hints???!!! I mean it's beginning with "Discoverer"!!! I must have had a lack of "finesse" ;-) :-(
But only after their disbanding the songs on CIN have made sense for me!  :-( :-( :-(

I completely agree.. the entire record is a "goodbye" from Michael's wave to the content of the songs, to even Scott telling a fan shortly after it was released, "if they ever play live ever again". Big hints.

And oh, that little thing about their WB contract ending...

Collapse into Now was a big love of mine from its release, but now, I've fallen even more madly in love with it.

[fanfan]

The one time I thought R.E.M. would disband was when I read on REMHQ that Christ Bilheimer wasn't employed by them anymore, that was even before the release of the album, if I remember correctly. I guess afterwards I must have completely forgotten about that, maybe I didn't want to see it.

[Sweet Fanny Addams]

OatiosSpellCheck, on 10 October 2011 - 10:55 AM, said:

How about the complete lack of promotion, besides a few individual magazine interviews. Mills saying on several occasions that he wasn't sure there was a future for the band...

I mean they didn't even play on Letterman, which they almost do.

If anyone was surprised by the announcement, you weren't paying attention. Forget cryptic lyrics or cover art - a band doesn't pour their heart and soul into an album and NOT promote it unless they've reached a full stop.

The only thing surprising is that they made a formal announcement. I think most of expected them to just fade away...

Well, I guess there's truth in not seeing what you don't want to see. It wasn't a shock to me but I didn't see it coming in this abrupt, irreversable way. See ya, don't wanna be ya?
In 20/20  hindshight the clues are there, but even Ethan who has a very close connection with the band didn't really know until REM made the public statement that it was goodbye forever, as of now.

[In the Corner]

robertandrews, on 10 October 2011 - 09:27 AM, said:

Collapse Into Now is the main reason I wasn't surprised about their announcement.

Same here.  When I heard All the Best I immediately took it as a farewell song.

[robertandrews]

Sweet Fanny Addams, on 10 October 2011 - 10:01 AM, said:

Please expand on that, I'm intrigued.

You know, the words.

[mrocks7]

fanfan, on 10 October 2011 - 11:38 AM, said:

The one time I thought R.E.M. would disband was when I read on REMHQ that Christ Bilheimer wasn't employed by them anymore, that was even before the release of the album, if I remember correctly. I guess afterwards I must have completely forgotten about that, maybe I didn't want to see it.

That was a move that made me start to wonder as well...

[Colinzeal]

It would be interesting to know how different the reviews of Collapse into now would have been if it was public knowledge they were splitting up before it was realised.

I imagine they would have been a lot more favourable in the respect that the main criticism was that there was too many references to the past. If it was known as a swan song I think it might have been more appreciated for what it is. I certainly appreciate it more since the split, it doesn't captures the highs of the nineties but It is a good way to end. It couldn't be Around the sun because it was awful, it couldn't be Accelerate because it was a transitional album. Collapse into now touches on the whole back catalogue and includes a few gems. Good ending.

That said, just watched "Live" and it reminded me that these songs will never be played live again. Sad.

[Sweet Fanny Addams]

robertandrews, on 10 October 2011 - 12:30 PM, said:

You know, the words.

Aah. OK. But there are other REM lyrics that could have been taken as farewell songs. Examples:
World Leader Pretend--
"I have been given the freedom
To do as I see fit
It's high time I've razed the walls
That I've constructed
It's amazing what devices you can sympathize...emapathize
This is my mistake. Let me make it good
I raised the walls, and I will be the one to knock it down"

Kohutek--

"She carried ribbons, she wore them out
Michael built a bridge...Michael tore it down
At least it's something you've left behind
Like Kohoutek, you were gone
Michael built a bridge... Michael tore it down
If I stand and holler... will I stand alone?"

The Wake up Bomb--
"I've had enough, I've seen enough, I've had it all, I'm giving up
I won the race, I broke the cup, I drank it all, I spit it up
I've had enough, I've seen enough, I've had it all, I'm giving up
I won the race, I broke the cup, I drank it all, I spit it up"

All of "What If We Give It Away"

and there are others.  Once the Warners contract was fulfilled there was a good chance they'd split. It's the way and the speed with which they've done it  that slightly confounds  me.

[Joni Smeke]

To me, nothing hints more at a breakup than "I'm not scared, I'm outta here" in the end of Electrolite, especially considering it was Bill's last album.

[Sweet Fanny Addams]

Joni Smeke, on 10 October 2011 - 01:48 PM, said:

To me, nothing hints more at a breakup than "I'm not scared, I'm outta here" in the end of Electrolite, especially considering it was Bill's last album.

D'oh!! How did I miss that one? Captain Obvious, please.

[robertandrews]

I'll respectfully say that I don't think any of those sings were designed to convey what Collapse Into Now was, which was a deliberate reflection, celebration, drawig a line and moving on confidently in a new direction to new future pursuits. I purged my thoughts on CIN at the time, so I won't again, but it was laden with it and, to me, it really did suggest what was later confirmed.

I take the points re: the brevity of the announcement. I think the words used appropriately celebrated the career and struck the right tone, but on reflection I can understand if some feel it's been done and dusted rather quickly, save for the forthcoming compilation. There was no public get-together at the office, no physical show of unity, as when Bill left; I get that. But I guess there's no rule book for this stuff. Seems the band are happy with the way they are moving on.

[Driver Nate]

I've listened to it since Mills let it be known that were "indications" of R.E.M.'s imminent demise on the record but it had no real effect on me either way. The most obvious "goodbye" (aside from "All the Best") appears to be "Blue" particularly since it's the last track on the album. In the years to come I may find it to be a difficult album to listen to because it's their swan song but right now, even in the context of Mills' remarks, it's not effecting me that way.

[rosie]

for some reason the reprise of discoverer made me feel that things were coming to an end, perhaps inasmuch as the wheel had turned full circle etc.  i've been trying to find a quote of michael's about, i think it was paul klee, describing the artist's craft as circular - the first half is spent learning their craft and the second unlearning it.  at that point one becomes a true artist.  i'm sure someone can clarify this.

sorry not to explain this more clearly, but the first time i heard the reprise, in some strange way i had that sense of sadness and finality.

[dtram]

Yeah, i had the same feeling with the discover reprise along with all the other things.  The record just felt like a closing to me and a damn good one at that.  Mighty fine way to go out.